Well and back to you..... I must say either you are very uninformed in
Security or either than you are an intentional "product basher". I will
not go further but to explain my statement....
Your proponent is your advice of the Linux alternative to all this and
here.... (quoted)
<<<If we assist them in living in the delusion that they are in a safe
environment, then we do them no favors.>>>
.... is you doing exactly that. I remind you that Linux and Firefox have
both been legally listed as riskware in official legal reports not too
long ago, and have corrected greatly. Windows has never been listed as
riskware. Internet Explorer is rated as the safest browser worldwide
since Version 8 and including newer version 9. Microsoft Internet
Explorer is part of the Windows Operating System and ergo has already
been rated as secure and stable so it goes as being the ONLY browser
worldwide to ever achieve "Unix Certification" because Microsoft Windows
has been the only Operating System to achieve "Unix Certification" and
therefore Internet Explorer being a part of that has been rated that. It
is not a separate part of Windows as some add on software or in any
bloatware package. It is part of the Windows Operating System. In that
Linux has not been able to achieve Unix Certification is just one fact
and legally that it is not more safe or more secure than Microsoft
Windows - and neither Apple/Mac.
Linux has never denied or disputed these FACTS though you have by
offering the alternative in the light of untrue product bashing. Linux
speaks for itself. It does not have to lie about other products to make
a dishonest buck. I have not known persons involved in Linux to be of
such ill repute as one may believe by your promotion of it. You are not
promoting Linux but rather dishonesty as false advertising and doing
Linux or Windows Users ANY favor at all by your dishonesty or ignorance
- as you have not made clear which yet. Ask anyone at Linux in other
words and they will say No Thanks we don;t use or need that kind of
Product Promotion and neither would we employ such an individual to do
so. Linux ezines must stand on their own merit as you must by their posts.
You are spreading a delusion in security by 'product bashing' and your
facts are less than laughable when examined. This is what "product
bashing" generally refers to - based on a foundation of mistruths and
open lies. Sometimes it is disallowed at a handful of forums I have
noticed and for obvious reasons.
NOT TRUE.... quoted
<<<Here is an example. Someone will find an exploit and announce it
publicly so that users will know and expect MS to patch it.>>>
That is illegal. No one may post legally any such code as proof of
concept or otherwise that is destructive to networks, equipment,
personal or company/corporate computers, etc. on the world wide web for
public or private view. My source is a friend who is employed by
MalwareBytes.Org in malware research whom I reported to an exact episode
of same and was immediately removed from the world web and actions taken
by Agencies.
NOT TRUE.... quoted
<<<Then they admit it and say that they are working on a fix. Then they
say the fix will be available next patch Tuesday which is two weeks
away.>>>
You are OBVIOUSLY product bashing or have made up a COMPLETE FANTASY
about Microsoft Windows or are simply completely ignorant of the truth.
The vast majority of Windows Users are well aware that through the
beginning to mid "XP Years" that Windows Updates were released
immediately after testing. This changed a few years ago, to as well
accommodate IT on corporate levels, to every Second Tuesday of the month
dubbed "Patch Tuesday". Any CRITICAL or ZERO DAY PATCH/FIX is released
IMMEDIATELY as OFFICIALLY called an OUT-OF CYCLE Microsoft Windows
Critical Update.
NOT TRUE.....quoted
<<<Those Russian botnets exploit XP machines and while they are doing
harm they would not be able to to it as effectively if Microsoft was on
the ball.>>>
I just posted correction to your mistruths. The Microsoft "Out Of Cycle"
Windows Update immediately patches security holes and/or code hardens.
Botnets are not known as primary culprits in these exploits. "Scareware"
as term for fake, rogue, pirated rebranded faulty malware infested
antimalware products are the primary attackers. The American FBI has
listed this as many many many others have. In fact the infamous SpyAxe
was about first to do so in the WMF Metafile zero day in Windows half a
decade ago. Using ignorance or mistruths via product bashing is NOT
helping Linux. You may be even HURTING new Linux users as thinking
that's the way ALL Linux people are - completely dishonest liars and
product bashers, what good could the product be ? You don;t want to do
that do you ? ! Then don't !
NOT TRUE .....quoted
<<<It does not affect me and so why should I care if others persist in
using an OS made of Swiss cheese.>>>
Again, if you are product bashing via number of Security Updates to
Windows by calling it "swiss cheese" meaning full of security holes the
nefarious can exploit then we look to Linux Updates and as well your
mention of them being published.... If we use your analogy of what
constitutes "swiss cheese" let's look at how many holes Linux has as
compared to Windows (which has had a handful in the last year - and I
run both a XP and Vista computer.....
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/9
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/10
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/11
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/13
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/233
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/234
Fwd: [USN-1137-1] Eucalyptus vulnerability
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/292
Fwd: [USN-1138-1] DBus-GLib vulnerability
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/294
Fwd: [USN-1138-2] NetworkManager and ModemManager update
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/295
Fwd: [USN-1140-1] PAM vulnerabilities
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/302
Fwd: [USN-1139-1] Bind vulnerabilities
Fwd: [USN-1146-1] Linux kernel vulnerabilities
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/318
Fw: [USN-1147-1] GIMP vulnerability
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/324
Fwd: [USN-1151-1] Nagios vulnerabilities
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/330
Fwd: [USN-1152-1] libvirt vulnerabilities
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/336
Fwd: [USN-1153-1] libxml2 vulnerability
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/337
Fwd: [USN-1154-1] OpenJDK 6 vulnerabilities
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/338
Fwd: [USN-1155-1] NBD vulnerability
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/LinuxDucks/message/351
OKAY THAT IS IN ABOUT ONE MONTH'S TIME ! ! ! Quazillions of Updates.
Windows has NEVER had such a caseload of Windows Updates. No need to
look it up or go ahead and google it. As source, I have been on Windows
with one of the very first Windows XP computers sold in Nov. 2001 to
present and Vista and 7 as well - and have had two or three offers from
some important security firms actually to boot (I am disabled and
declined).
Now via YOUR definition of "SWISS CHEESE" - we are looking at it ! ! !
Linux would be that and NOT Windows. Neither has Linux been attacked on
the level Windows has been since it all began around the beginning of
this last decade.... 2000 to 2010. Frankly there security departments
have not had the level of attack and defense and will NOT achieve their
sophistication until the next decade after 2020 IF they were attacked
like Windows was/is starting tomorrow. Again experience is the best
teacher in some cases. In security you gain a "nose" and can sniff
trouble and were as, or before, it happens. These are the top employees
in security.
And the truth is, as I said Linux speaks for itself, here we see how
busy they are and produce their equivalent of Windows Critical Security
Updates through Update Manager. The ORIGINAL security argument came (and
from many people as you speak here) about 2006 to 2008 that Linux,
Apple/Mac, and Firefox were virtually malware immune and make Windows
look like a joke. This lying and unfaithful and mistruths have been
shown as the basis of dishonest or uninformed and sometimes even called
"newbie hype" - basis or foundation and platform for "product bashing"
and why this is frowned upon and most times actually disallowed by all
honest users in the Community of computer operators on the worldwide web.
The truth in the above argument was based upon that 90 percent of all
world computer ran Windows and was "were the money" is for those
committing cyber theft via cyber crimewares such as password stealing
viruses that also ran through Firefox via Java exploits, spyware
installations, other crimewares as ransomware. It is too risky and
costly for the cyber criminal underground to go "social engineering"
hunting in tiny ponds where there is little internet financial
transaction occurring - the other 10 percent of operating systems
including Linux and Apple/Mac. THIS was and still is the truth about
Windows being attacked so heavily and we have not even touched on
Botnets via Botherders, Botlords, Botmasters committing corporate cyber
crime via their botnet attacks in the form of Denial of Service
Distribution Attacks (DDoS) holding corporations worldwide for illegal
extortion ! Windows computers.
When the level of attacks happen to Linux and Apple/Mac that have
occurred to Windows we will see how they fair. They will either do as
good a job or a horrible one being way behind the patch/fix/updates
immediately necessary. From what I have seen I would say their first
incidents will be as awkward as it was for Windows.
Remember that just very recently both Linux Kernel Org and the Linux
Software Repository have been hacked. This has NEVER occurred with
Windows save the one incident of the Windows Updates website itself
blocked by hackers temporarily during a zero day keeping slothful users
from getting the Critical Update/Patch to block them out. These slothful
users either by apathy or bad directions from bad or uninformed user
helpers or simple ignorance of not knowing did not have Windows Updates
set to Automatic Install as instructed and recommended to by Microsoft
and the vast majority of responsible informed Windows users as we are
and know to be.
NOW I do not wish to take back some compliments I made towards you but I
think I SHOULD as I now suspect in your several answers together as I
very slightly suspected that you are doing NOTHING but your little
PRODUCT BASHING of Windows skit for all Linux Users. I feel the
Owner/Moderator of this group should take action for same. I have made
the case I feel for that.
The discussion here was not Linux or Windows - but SECURITY - which is
what you have dishonestly or ignorantly given what you called.... (quoted)
<<<If we assist them in living in the delusion that they are in a safe
environment, then we do them no favours.>>>
You have given such delusion as to condemn yourself as dishonest in your
product bashing portrayal of your position as being security correct
with and for Linux to at least all the users in this group and all RSS
Visitors to the group worldwide via RSS Readers of Public messages.
I will NOT post again and will maintain my position - and well spelled
out - that I feel you have been dishonest and are nothing more than a
Windows Product Basher as dishonest mistruths. In security we teach
truth to the public so that they are enabled and EMPOWERED to make
INFORMED DECISIONS as to computer security and their own security
solutions for the same. Product Bashers do their best to misguide this
most times as self aggrandizing but are very hurtful to uninformed
followers. This is the main reason product bashers in security are
immediately disallowed to continue further.
The only way I could not believe you are performing Windows Product
Bashing is perhaps for you to read some, and study some, and verify
some, and come back with some reply to admit you were ignorantly wrong
in your statements. (I am a group owner and would have banned you
already ! )
Otherwise I need NOT reply further. My reply of information to you is
quite sufficient as just a little more than 'surface'.
gerald philly pa usa
Amateur Forensics (computer)
Webmaster http://bluecollarpc.us/
IF YOU WISH TO HONESTLY PROMOTE WONDERFUL LINUX WITH THE REST PLEASE DO
NOT RESORT TO DISHONEST DECEITFUL PRODUCT BASHING. YOU ARE HURTING NO
ONE BUT YOUR OWN REPUTATION AND PERHAPS THE MINDS OF THE NOVICES. THANK
YOU !
--a concerned, VERY concerned Linux User and contributor !
On 11/1/2011 6:58 AM, Roy wrote:
> I meant in a broader context. Windows users will only know that Windows
> sucks and that it is part of the problem, if they experience it for what it
> is. If we assist them in living in the delusion that they are in a
> safe environment, then we do them no favours. Aside from that I have become
> a bit jaded about it all. It does not affect me and so why should I care if
> others persist in using an OS made of Swiss cheese.Those Russian botnets
> exploit XP machines and while they are doing harm they would not be able to
> to it as effectively if Microsoft was on the ball.
>
> Here is an example. Someone will find an exploit and announce it publicly
> so that users will know and expect MS to patch it. So, MS goes all quiet
> first. Then they deny it when asked directly. Then they say they are
> looking into it. Then they admit it and say that they are working on a fix.
> Then they say the fix will be available next patch Tuesday which is two
> weeks away. A month has passed and those botnets have been busy and the
> problem has travelled aroud the world affecting millions of MS customers.
> That would be bad if it happened just once, but it is the script.
>
> So, little old me, using Linux thinks, if MS does not care, why should I?
> MS has denied that the said botnets use Windows or exploit Windows, but
> they also say that the world will be safer when XP is closed down. We live
> in a world of contradictions. My contradiction is that using Linux to help
> Windows users is like peeing on a forest fire when the forest ranger is
> asleep and the arsonists know it. As I said, I have been around the block a
> few times and have lost my enthusiasm for helping those who do not want it.
> So I handle the contradiction of not seeming to care, by using something
> that is far safer and trying to spread the word that it does not have to be
> this way, rather than saving people who do not know they are in trouble and
> are not asking for my help.
>
> Using an AV for me is not a good use of my time. I would rather be typing
> long messages to you. :)
>
> Roy
>
> Using Kubuntu 11.10, 64-bit
> Location: Canada
>
>
> On 31 October 2011 23:11, G.LinuxDucks<g.linuxducks@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> **
>>
-------------cut----------------cut----------------------- /
No comments:
Post a Comment